Mark Keil: Journeyman Tennis Player Who Beat Pete Sampras

0:00:00.1 Jack Broudy: This is Jack Broudy and I'm today happy to talk to an old friend of mine. We're living at the 45 with Mark Kyle and Mark say hi from Hawaii. Okay, very good. Mark and I go back a ways. We used to play tennis together. We used to talk tennis, you know, 45 degree angle figure eight way back when 2025 years ago and I knew him when he moved to San Diego area because I knew he was the I believe what is your title the lowest ranked player to ever beat number one or to beat Pete Sampras. It's one of those two.

0:00:42.7 Mark Keil: I'm the worst tennis player ever to beat Pete Sampras. But when he was in the top 10, I was ranked 224 when I beat him in 1991 on grass.

0:00:53.3 Jack Broudy: That's incredible. He wasn't number one at the time.

0:00:56.3 Mark Keil: He was number eight. It was a year after he won the US Open and it was at the Queen's Club ATP event in London and I've been playing for a few years. I had left college at University of South Florida. I was ranked 268 in the world when I left college as a collegiate player, but unfortunately, I never got into the NCAA's our schedule was a little bit limited, but it was still pretty good. I kind of improved when I went when I moved from Albuquerque to Tampa and went to USF. I made a big jump and then the summers I played the tennis futures and then I went on the tour and I got a sponsor a teammate of mine's father of Japanese players. Father gave me some finances to go on the tour, but I still was 268. I was the second highest ranked collegiate tennis player in college. Number one was a guy top 100 at the time Jeff Turango from Stanford. I know Jeff. No, Jeff, you know, Jeff, you know, it's Jeff Turango, but I was ranked like 42 in college. So but we had a pretty good schedule Jack. Well, you know, I'm guessing number one at 90 1991 was that late in Hewitt number one in 91 was I believe still.

0:02:14.9 Mark Keil: Stephan Edberg or Becker was up there. I think Lendl was at the end of his career, but Edberg Becker McEnroe still was top 20. He was at the end, but it was pretty strong tennis time pretty strong group up there in the top 10.

0:02:34.3 Jack Broudy: The 90s were great era in my opinion. They were really that was still that was till the end of the 90s mid-90s. We there were still a lot of serving and volley, which I played that was my style of play, which I learned growing up in Albuquerque. You know, I've played a few sets against you. I can't keep you off the net and if you first serve if he first serves too big and too well placed. I'm like fine. I just got to get a serve back. I know I can take some points here. If I get a serve back just make me move now. Now I wouldn't want to play you. I'm a little little little got a few extra pounds. But yeah, you know growing up in Albuquerque. It's similar to where you live in Denver. It's high-altitude tennis. So all I did was serve and volley when I was growing up. I I that's where I learned how to play South of you down there from Colorado in Albuquerque and actually we're out of the cookies should be called the mile high City because we're we're actually a mile high to like Denver.

0:03:32.4 Mark Keil: And so there's not never knew I didn't know that I thought you were lower desert. I didn't know that Albuquerque is a mile high. So it's exactly the same altitude as Denver. So we were the second mile high City. A lot of people don't know that but yeah growing up in Albuquerque is, you know when you move from San Diego, I don't know how you're how are you adjusting from the low altitude the balls flying everywhere.

0:03:56.0 Jack Broudy: Well, it's funny. It did take me a couple of weeks. First couple weeks out here. I played with a couple guys and yeah, all the balls were going along and balls were skidding. It seemed like it skid moved a little quicker and and I wasn't used to it. Plus I was sucking wind a little my first time I played was way up high up around 8700 feet up in Winter Park. And that's first time I played out here and that's really that's way higher than Denver and I was sucking wind. So it was a little strange in that respect now after a year. I got to tell you my health, you know, my lungs feel great out here and I don't drink as much beer because you can't because he had just to so I can't do that. Since I stopped playing in 01. I've coached for 20 years in different locations around the world. I coached in Kazakhstan at a tennis Academy. I went to China. I just kind of like to go to my teaching philosophy was go to a few place go to a place for a couple years and give give what I know wherever I'm at and then move on.

0:05:03.4 Jack Broudy: I like to I like to travel a lot. But now that older now, I'm pretty much settled here in Waikiki Beach since my dad he after Albuquerque when I went to college, he became a research scientist at UH Manoa and he was here for 30 years and I moved here eight years ago to be near to him. I didn't live with him, but I had an apartment in Waikiki and he fortunately passed away in March. So it's okay was great last because when I left at 18, my condolences, my condolences. Thank you. Thank you. When I left at 18, I didn't see my family very much. My mom, my parents are divorced. My mom lives in Peoria. I'm going to go visit her this this weekend and for Thanksgiving and yeah, so it was great to see him. I saw him every few weeks. We had lunch and it was great to reconnect because you know, like I said at 18, I went to college and then I went on the tool for 12 years and then I coached internationally and nationally but San Diego was great. I met you and you introduced me to this contraption the 45 board.

0:06:05.5 Mark Keil: What's the title? Is it? It was the 8 board.

0:06:10.2 Jack Broudy: Remember now Broudy board.

0:06:12.9 Jack Broudy: Yeah, now I have these now. I have these, you know, they're always sitting on the ground with wherever I am. So I have these two swivels. So, you know, when I need to I you know, have to get up and relax a little off the state off the you know, computer. I just get on and do my figure 18, but they're same thing as we had same things we have, but they're not attached anymore and they work better, of course, because 20 more years of, you know, ingenuity or research and development, whatever you want to call that. Awesome.

0:06:43.2 Mark Keil: What a great invention such a great teaching tool. I always when I when I when I do teach lessons, I always talk about your hitting the ball at a 45 degree angle, which I think is so important.

0:06:53.6 Jack Broudy: Such man knows what he's talking about such an important teaching tools for hitting at 45 because then you're in front of it, but not too far in front not too far back.

0:07:03.4 Jack Broudy: But that's right.

0:07:04.8 Jack Broudy: It's a great. It gives people a visual, you know, of what perfection would look like if there's perfection, right? That's what it was really correct. Anyway, well, I'm glad you do use an art system. That's terrific. And then that'll that'll bode well for me using that part of this clip. Sure, but so tell me something. I know people going to hear this because you are what I would call I got a lot of friends that did just what you did. You know, I got one of my boys now Warren Woods out there just got his 8th ATP point, I think so. He's like top 1100 in the world. So, you know, journeyman tennis player is what I'm talking about. So you're a journeyman ball player out there in 1990 and What I mean, I'm sure it's different back then than it is today. I know today you have to travel all over and my guys gotten a lot of his points out in Africa actually. Because he had to travel that far and I think some in Mexico too. But for starters, what was it like back then in the early 90s, you know, grinding it out as a journeyman just just a little background that would be very interesting to me.

0:08:18.0 Jack Broudy: No problem.

0:08:18.7 Jack Broudy: Yeah. Well, I I played the Nationals the last three years of my junior career in Albuquerque Kalamazoo tennis and a couple of hard courts. So I got a national tennis ranking, but I wasn't really highly recruited. So I wrote over a hundred schools. My dad was a professor and I got a letter and I a form letter and I wrote because back then they didn't have the these these recruiting websites where you're like five-star recruit or whatever and they come out for you at that time. My father said I put a little money into your junior career. I you need to get a full scholarship. I had a few walk-on opportunities at top 10 schools, but my father said, well, you I think you should play you deserve a full scholarship. So University of South Florida answered my letter and I went on a visit and I got a full scholarship and actually that was a that was a huge huge point in my career as far as becoming a pro because I never would have been a profile with a state. I was going to go to University of New Mexico where my dad was a professor, but I didn't get a full ride offer.

0:09:19.3 Jack Broudy: So I went to South Florida and Tampa and Florida as you know, is the hotbed of tennis and I arrived there as a freshman. I played for my fall my freshman year and then I played one my I just really improved a lot there the low altitude and my attacking style of chipped and charge came in and then I got up and in the summers I play some futures in the States and I did pretty well and then I went to South Africa. I took my finals early my sophomore year and I played some 25,000 because I was ranked like 450 because I got I did pretty well in the futures, but I wasn't that great of a collegiate player for some reason. I don't know why this the whole tennis team aspect was great, but I was more of an individualistic person and so then when I came back to school, I got was ranked 268 entering my junior year and then I played the fall and after I did well those challengers a teammate of mine's dad came to me and said he had a golf Academy in Tampa. His father did he was Japanese and he said I'm going to give you 30,000 a year for five years.

0:10:21.3 Jack Broudy: We just want 30% of your prize money. Would you like to go on the tour because they knew that I was a little stagnating a little bit at South Florida. Now they have a big-time program. They're close to top 25, but we had a good schedule. We played the Gators the Canes the Seminoles some schooled schools in the Southeast. So I decided to go on the tour and that's and that was what was enabling me is having that money and I gave him a little bit of percentage, but I was playing to be honest to make it in pro tennis. You need to play tennis especially when you're starting out. You need to play almost 40 tennis tournaments a year unless you're a guy like Pete Sampras who's so talented and can just move up so quickly, but these days it's so so much depth Jack that you got it. You got it. Well, you got you got to grind you got you got to go but it's fun that you got the thing is is if you don't really love the game and have passion for don't even think about going on the tour. You got to love traveling.

0:11:14.0 Jack Broudy: You got to want to see the world, but even at the future events back then they were satellites. It's great. You get free housings most of the time. There's there's you know, there's are people watching a little bit. You just got to love the whole process and I never thought I'd be a pro tennis player at all until my USF college coach Fred Bill parents said, you know, I think you should give the pro tour shot and so I did and then it took a couple of years, but I actually had an injury. I broke my foot when I when I started playing and I dropped to 800 but then I came back and my highest singles ranking was 167 but you know when I was 24 is when I when I was playing the qualities of Queens and I was ranked 224. So I was on the cusp and I've been playing for a few years and I was thinking well if this doesn't happen soon or something doesn't big in my life doesn't happen. I'm probably going to just go back and finish school and and get a real job. But you know, so before Queens I was playing doubles and challengers on the slope German red clay and I was winning a couple challengers serving and balling serving involving.

0:12:20.4 Jack Broudy: Sure. Sure. You'd be a better doubles tennis player. Your crime. So I showed up at Queens and I got into qualities and sure enough, you know Pete Sampras. He was eight in the world at the time. It was a year after he won the US Open. He wasn't physically developed like he obviously we can't compare careers, but he he was still a good player obviously eight in the world and He I think after he lost in the French. I don't know pretty early that year. He was always by the second California and so he wasn't really in that and then he came to his first grass court tour was Queen so the stars all the line. My dad was a star scientist. So so I went to the qualities at Queens Club beautiful Club. By the way, the night opinion. They're the best grass tennis courts in the world. They're better than Wimbledon in my opinion. They really are there. They're in fact, I think they hired the Queen's yardsman. The guy that the grass court guy to go from Queens of 25 years ago to Wimbledon, but they changed the grass. That's a whole nother story though.

0:13:21.8 Jack Broudy: It's much slower now, but back in the day and since my days of growing up in Albuquerque serving and following that's where I learned how to play. So I played the qualities and I played three guys to get in the main draw and each match with three sets. So I've already played nine sets of grass court tennis. So I'm feeling good. I played three British guys. They all went three sets and then the first round of play the top hunter player from Germany by the name of Patrick Bauer good player and then I beat him in three sets. So I had 12 sets because Pete had a buy. So June 11th, 1991 is the day that I played and then subsequently you talked about me being a journeyman. Well, I made a documentary film called the journeyman about my life on the tour. So so then I play so I've had 12 sets under my belt. San Francisco has got to buy. It's a blustery windy day. I go out to warm up with the guy named Brad Pierce who's from Utah close State to you. He was the head coach at BYU and he was a quarterfinalist in singles at Wimbledon one year great junior played at UCLA tennis and so he warms me up and he says Mark you can beat this guy and I had no real confidence.

0:14:30.6 Jack Broudy: I knew it was going to be obviously a huge opportunity for me. The match was live on BBC in Europe. So I get out to the cameras are on and the whole time. I'm just looking down at them down at the at the ground because I'm really nervous. There's about 5,000 people watching at Center Court, Queens Club, London, Palisades Road, England. So I'm warming up. I play the first set. I'm on because I played 12 sets. He just got there a few days before and he hasn't played any practice sets and it's windy as hell and it's windy and you know, he hates win. He hates win. So the stars are lining up lining up and so that I win. I win the first tennis set really easy 6-2 and he had never heard of me. He had said in the press conference after but I was 224, you know, and I've been on the road for three years playing 35 weeks a year grinding it out futures challengers doing well doing okay in both. I think I was like 200 doubles also and then I am on the ATP tour second set was a tight battle.

0:15:30.9 Jack Broudy: It came to a tiebreaker and if I would have lost that set, I would have lost the match because he was really getting to do a groove. So I think it out in the second set breaker and that you know that and then and then that kind of gave me the confidence after beating him. He was eight in the world to say, okay, maybe I should stay out here a little bit longer and subsequently I became a double specialist because I started making more money playing doubles and I got to 32 in the world and won five ATP tour titles and doubles but unfortunately the next match I played in Malavai, Washington and great tennis player. He got to the final grade player. I won the first set 7-6 and I'm looking at the crowd like I'm going to win the tournament then he beats me two and three. So that's another thing is you got to stay in the woke up. Well, you got to stay in the moment. Exactly. He woke up and you got to stay in the moment. So but that was that was a great great week of my life and then at the end of my career when I was declining and when I was 32, I made a documentary film about life on the tour with another player you and you can get it on Vimeo.

0:16:36.6 Jack Broudy: It's called a journeyman and there's a part two of that to called journeyman to about life on the tour what it's like to be a pro tennis player, but it was at the end of my career was kind of a catharsis. I wasn't working that hard. I was having marriage problems. I ended up marrying a beautiful Swede when I met on the tennis tour, but yeah, so that was that day was great and I, you know, make a joke out of the worst place, but I was the lowest ranked player ever to beat. Mr. Sampras when he was top 10 in singles at 224 when he was top 2010. Wow, that is unbelievable story. So I guess I knew you the whole time you were in San Diego somehow. We got fortunate because we hung out a lot you and I I worked at La Costa Tennis Resort and Spa for a little bit.

0:17:23.5 Mark Keil: That's right. And that was and I was that was a good experience and then I moved on. I went to Hong Kong and taught tennis. But yeah, I coached a woman's player on the tour from San Diego and mall. She had no ranking and we got her to play Davis Fed Cup for Ireland. So there was that I remember and I remember and well, yeah, she's she was a good player before but then she took a break and then I did a little she did a little modeling for me with the board.

0:17:52.6 Mark Keil: Awesome. Awesome. Yes.

0:17:54.0 Jack Broudy: Good-looking woman. Great player. She's doing well. You see this guy here. You see this guy right here.

0:18:04.3 Jack Broudy: He just got an award at USDA Hall of Fame in her mouth. From it. That's right.

0:18:09.2 Mark Keil: And his name is Anton and I work with him. I coach him and I played him in I think I played him here 10 years ago in the USDA Playoffs for the USDA Wild Card tournament. I think didn't he live in Hawaii for a while. He went to university.

0:18:28.7 Jack Broudy: Yeah, not University of Hawaii, but the other one whatever it was called.

0:18:32.7 Mark Keil: HBU, Hawaii Pacific University.

0:18:35.0 Jack Broudy: That's it Hawaii Pacific. That's who he played for and yeah, he was a great player played Davis Cup for his country, Belarus. And so right now our goal is to be number one in the nation men's 35. She turned 35 about six months ago. We decided that was our goal and I think he's already, you know, five. He's only played like four tournament three tournaments.

0:18:55.2 Mark Keil: Why are you already fired? Great player. He smashed me. Is he does he work for you too? Does he teach tennis? Is that his living?

0:19:03.9 Jack Broudy: Well, he teaches tennis our style. He's one of my member tennis pros, you know, he works with my company and he's coaching here in town and and does well there, but we've got it so he can go travel whenever we need to and we go here and there and we're going to the Nationals. I believe they're in Arkansas next year like in April and that's what we're gearing up for is to win that tournament and to get the number one ranking. That's our goal. Awesome.

0:19:31.6 Mark Keil: I know Anton. I played him here many years ago at the USDA tennis Playoff. Yeah, he just smoked me. The guy was a nice guy. We talked about that. Yeah, that's that's great. No, there's no question. You your knowledge of the game is great Jackie and I remember you coaching the number one junior in the country Foreman. I forgot his first name.

0:19:50.1 Jack Broudy: Steven. Yeah, I talked to him just recently. Yes, Steve Forman and yeah, we worked with some good players, you know, I mean, why is this why didn't Foreman? Why didn't Foreman go on the tour? Just didn't want to didn't want to work like that didn't want to he knew what the reality was and he just didn't want to do. He told me I flat-out asked him and the other boy member. I Warren would he's now back on tour at 27 or 28 and he's the one. I just told you about is about a thousand in the world and got another guy Nick who got some got financing. So he's out there. So they're out there also working it. Yeah, they're out there working it and but yeah, that's that's great. You played Anton. That's funny. Tell me about that match. His his game doesn't suit you though, because if you tried to come force your way into net, he's pretty good when you give him a target.

0:20:42.5 Mark Keil: Well, this was 2011 and I that was when I came back and live for one year before I went to teach but then you know, I've been retired for 10 years. I was all out of shape overweight. No, he was this was just now. This was this was you know, when I was 45 years old. Oh, yeah, so later when I was when I was 45 teaching tennis and you know, definitely not in the best shape and notes. I mean, but the guy I think he ended up winning that tournament and going to the playoffs in Connecticut because if you win that then you get a wild card into the US Open but he was a phenomenal talent and they produce some pretty good players at HPU that in UH, there's only two real tennis tennis. Sure entities in town Division one in their Division 2, but yeah, he's a I mean, that's great that he's working and teaching and yeah, there's no I definitely see him being number one in the in the in as he looks fit looks lean and mean and I'm sure you got him eating those good Colorado how Colorado grass out there and eating well and playing well.

0:21:56.3 Jack Broudy: We hit the gym, especially in the winter. We hit the gym probably more than the court. We hit the gym a lot. So we're trying that's the big thing is to stay in shape when you're 35, you know, that's a pivotal point. I think and and so he's staying in really good shape like a kid. I think and it's hell. That's getting me in better shape. I mean, I started working out with him about six months ago and I'm happy to be back in a little leaner a little meaner, you know, yes. Yes. So he's been inspirational for me and he's a great guy. If you if you remember Anton, he's a great guy. Yes, very friendly, very nice, very fair. It was nice playing him. I remember we played out at Corp Central Oahu Regional Park and that's when I met him and yeah, he was one of you. I think he was an All-American at HPU Division 2. And yeah, I mean, like you said, you got to have a different sense of mentality to go out on the tour and this guy Warren Wood. That's great. He just needs to play a lot of events.

0:22:52.9 Mark Keil: It's expensive to but especially if you're starting out, but you got to play week in week out or when you do get the opportunity to yeah, well, you're ready for it's always great to see these players at 28 or 30 some of the women at 30 32 or after they have a baby come back and play great tennis, you know and change.

0:23:12.1 Jack Broudy: Yeah, I stopped at 32. You're totally correct. It's great. These guys are much more they're just bestly just like in everything is evolution of sport. They are getting a much more professionals word. I like they're just more professional than back in the 90s and 80s and 70s every every era seems to be more professional now. They have teams. We never had a team went by ourselves usually because of the you know, the prize money wasn't as lucrative as it is now, but yeah, so it was a it's it's it's tough back in the 90s. It was great though, because you got to know your opponent more like, you know, it stayed the tournament hotel and obviously took me a few years before I made it in doubles, but you know, you get picked up in in courtesy cars at the ATP Tour level and the state nice hotels for free to get two meals a day breakfast and lunch and then dinner you just go down to the lobby. Maybe have a beer, you know, at about five just one one beer and then you go to dinner with your colleagues, but now doesn't seem like it's even more so like robots and it's just I don't know if that's good or not, but it's just me.

0:24:16.6 Jack Broudy: I know to I played a little bit of the tour. I played that watch tennis tour back in like 75 or something and and you know, it was more like just a glorified Junior Tour, you know, I mean it was just and you know, you did have housing and stuff like that. It was kind of the same but yeah, that was back in, you know in the 70s. I mean, so that's a long time ago, but where did you play collegially?

0:24:41.7 Jack Broudy: I started tennis at Chapel Hill and I finished at and then I read sure I played tournaments for a year and then I went to UC San Diego and stayed there for 45 years and wow. Yeah. Yeah, I couldn't find any place better than then I had enough after a while, but I'm happy to be here and you know, live a lifetime on the on the beach. Now, I'm going to live the rest of my life on the the mountains. So that's kind of cool. You know what I mean? Yeah, it's like having a whole nother shot at life here. Great, you know, you made me think of something.

0:25:13.2 Mark Keil: I'll ask you real quick and I really appreciate your time and these are great great stories. I love them and so helpful for I got college kids thinking about going pro now even play a lot of events get some backing but you got to play week in week out try to be based in a place where you can train with other great players. Tampa was great because I just moved from my college to Saddlebrook. I got an apartment there had a couple roommates and then I started training with Saddlebrook and then Saddlebrook was a rosettes key sample is Capriatti Hingis and so I'm around that every day in between tournaments and I'm starting to practice with them. So you get the feeling it's like little osmosis you start to feel oh I can play with or not.

0:25:55.1 Jack Broudy: I remember I remember I used to work for when I was 18. I worked for Harry Hotman. Great coach.

0:26:02.0 Jack Broudy: That's he's my guy. He was Saddlebrook tennis was the place I trained. That'll Brooke is where I worked for Saddlebrook for two summers, you know, just summer tennis jobs. No fun. It was crazy. What was he like? What was it like working for him? Hop was funny. You know, I got along really well with him. But he was and I worked hard. I always worked hard. So he liked anyone who worked hard and you know, I never, you know, shrugged off a run at the end of the day and run five miles. I never I just did it all and all that and he liked you and and I was always fond of the guy. He was could be a tough son of a bitch though for a lot of people. I mean, I do remember I only took a couple lessons. I mostly just worked for him, but I did take a couple lessons before when I was like 16 or 17 and he would be like, no younger younger, but he was tougher as a coach. I liked working for him when I only when he was a coach. He just called me a girl and you know, he'd spit on the ground, you know, because he you know, he'd have you a net and Vitas Gerulaitis.

0:27:06.0 Jack Broudy: You remember he could fly all over the place. So Gerulaitis was older than me a little bit. And so he was running around playing incredible tennis and Hopman loved him, of course loved him. So he'd hit the ball in the alley and I just watch it go, you know, and I'm standing in the middle of the net. What are you girl go for every ball, you know, practice your starts. He always said practice your starts meaning practice your starts and he'd spit and he'd yell the scream. So but I liked him anyway, because when he wasn't doing that, he's a pretty nice guy sweet guy, you know, and I liked him. But yeah, I just that just when I took lessons those couple of times boy. He was rough.

0:27:49.0 Mark Keil: He was opposite of Bob. Yeah, there was either going to ball of Harry Hopman and I got I got groomed by by the Hopman method of practicing and it was great. Yeah, to one grinding when I when I want to want once all morning you want to want to want once in the morning and then sets in the afternoon. That's right. That's exactly what it was.

0:28:11.2 Jack Broudy: Yep. That's what it was when I went there and that's when it was when I worked for him. And yeah, I always like the afternoon. You just walked around every once in a while. You had to play the kids a set but in general. Yeah, I went to his camp one year and it was a grinder. There's no doubt. It was a grinder. They really he liked hard work, you know, Harry, he liked hard work. But yeah, no, it's fun.

0:28:33.0 Mark Keil: But I was going to ask you one question.

0:28:36.6 Jack Broudy: So, you know, in golf, they got LIV, right? Yes, because of many reasons politics this and that money protecting your players. Well, you know, I it dawned on me this morning. Well, just I'm a big Novak Djokovic fan. I wasn't I was always a Federer fan, but Djokovic bust his way in and you had to give the guy credit for taking out Fed and Nadal. It was pretty thought. Unbelievable. I thought it was unbelievable back in the day and you know, 15 years ago and I just think between that and banning the Russian players and the WTA having to step up and all this stuff going on. And I mean what they banned. I mean, Djokovic just doesn't hardly play the Grand Slams anymore, you know, kicked out of the US open for just inadvertently hitting a ball, you know, I didn't think it was that bad really and I'm like you think there'll be a live in tennis. I see it.

0:29:34.5 Jack Broudy: You know what since you're you're you're you're pretty entrepreneurial and looking into the future and I think that's a great question. Not many people have talked about it, but you realize that in my opinion, you know, I'm an ATP alumni member or was and and yeah, so I support the Union. They tried to do that separate Union, but I think that's dead Djokovic started this other players and I don't know if I agree with that but starting a whole nother tour is a different situation. I think that is something because when you compare tennis, it's top eight in the world for sports when you compare tennis to other sports as far as like the 200 ranked basketball player compared to 200 ranked tennis player the money discrepancies just so big. I feel that they say and I'm people might not like this, but they say oh you get 75 grand for the US open. That's unbelievable losing first round. I don't think that's enough. I think 300 grand. It's top 128 in the world. If you're top 128 baseball basketball golfer just compare golf individual sports golf prize money to tennis prize money is a joke compared the 200 ranked golfer is making almost double in my opinion.

0:30:48.5 Mark Keil: I think than the 200th ranked tennis player. So it's coming to that situation where they need to have more tournaments and I think another tool could possibly happen. I don't know when but obviously tennis isn't as popular as golf. That's where I think it might not work because so many people play golf in the world a little bit more than tennis, but I definitely feel like I'm going to agree with you. I think there will be another tour in the next five years.

0:31:19.2 Jack Broudy: That's what I think. I think it's coming. I think maybe even sooner than that, you know, there'll be some wealthy people just saying I can market this because tennis is very marketable. Let's face it. It's exciting. Listen back in the early 80s late 70s. There was more money in tennis than there was in golf before Tiger Woods and a lot of other things.

0:31:39.4 Mark Keil: Wow, interesting. Okay. Okay. It was more money. You know that well tennis was everything right?

0:31:44.6 Mark Keil: Farrah Fawcett and Vinnie. Yeah, every on all the celebrities were going to LaCosta when it was big big braid and it was on TV all the time network TV and I just think, you know, it was done right back then and it was very exciting very sexy sport when you were probably not even around. I think you're that much younger than me and I was born in 67. Yeah, but the tennis eight seventies the boom was huge. Right? That was a battle of the sexes. You battle. Yeah, battle. Yeah, ABC wide world of sports. Exactly. They had the Alan King classic in Vegas. They had the yeah, it's like tennis was like in the 70s like pickleball is right now.

0:32:25.5 Jack Broudy: I guess I don't I barely say the P word, but I played a I played a pro-am pro celebrity tournament at LaCosta a couple years in a row with the Ralph from Ralph's and who was there Mel Brooks played with him once. So yeah, I mean back in the late 70s early 80s. That was the heyday right? Hef's Hef's Mansion. Everybody went to Hef's Mansion played tennis and you watched and jumped in Jacuzzi all the UCLA players, right? Yes. I mean it was a whole day. Well, you see. Yeah, that's right. You don't know but it was a whole different world back then, you know for tennis. So yeah, it has to be done. Right. I'll tell you, you know, Indian Wells. He does a good job out there. I know he makes small fortune every time. Ellison. Yeah, he does a great job out there. Great event. Yeah, he's turned it into a fifth Grand Slam. They say he basically yes great tournament, but when I was were one of my what was my worst defeat ever was that Indian Wells.

0:33:29.3 Jack Broudy: I got the semi-finals in doubles and I was playing with Stefan Kruger All-American at SMU South Africa and you probably don't know him and we were playing Luke Jensen who you know, you got Murphy coming on on Friday playing Luke Jensen and Scott Melville. Oh boy, semi-finals and it was we won the first set and it's in the breaker in the second and we're serving 6-5 second serve my partner and I cross and I had an easy backhand to win it. I remember like yesterday and I missed it. Why so easy would have been in the finals against Laconte Noah and or for oh wow. So for the finals of Indian Wells tennis and I missed it and to this day, that's that's the worst defeat. I mean, you know, it's only doubles but doubles was my living. I made a million dollars playing over 12 years and yeah, it was a good. It was a great life. It was I called the Roman Empire of Mike of Mike of my life from the age of when I went 18 to college. I had a full scholarship. So I felt kind of like a big man on campus.

0:34:28.6 Jack Broudy: It was great smaller school. I mean not no football team. So and then I went on the tour for 12 years. So from 18 to 32 was was basically the best time my life coaching is a little difficult. I had I've had some problems, you know, it was it was good coaching but it's just totally different. As you know, you got to have a different mindset, but I enjoyed that too and an Empress, you know, he spent most of his career in Tampa, which was a good movie. He had a nice house. I bought a house after I started making money in this gated community and then he lived in another gated community with a much bigger almost like a mansion and we used to have speaking of Hopman tennis academy as you know, they move from Largo. You probably work for him in Largo. I did Largo. It was out it they moved out to Wesley Chapel and there was a so I lived in North Tampa and it's about it. You know 20 minute drive from from my house. I bought a little single condo house and in the gated community and there was a contest every time about driving to you know, all the players who were based in Tampa had a house either in the city or close by and so we'd have a contest who could get there the quickest and samples had a 9-eleven latest model 90 silver beautiful 9-eleven turbo and you know, we'd always come there and go how long to take you 8 minutes 27 seconds.

0:35:48.6 Mark Keil: It was crazy. So one day Pete Sampras is driving at that time now, it's all developed at the time. It was just cow pastures and two-lane Highway. I remember and so Pete out to out to Wesley Chapel. So Pete was driving real fast incredibly fast out there in a Hillsborough County Sheriff Sheriff Deputy pulls him over and he's like, oh my gosh, I was really worried because he was going where really fast in excess of 100 miles per hour. And this is probably you know, because you wouldn't think that of him, but he was he was a you know, he was a fun guy. So he gets pulled over and and the cop comes up to him and says, you know, can I license registration place? You know, he's a southern guy Pete hands over and he's thinking all man. This is this is not good. I'm going to get in the papers. They're going to make they might even take take me off the jail if you go over a certain speed of they take sometimes they just take you straight away. So he was really sweating in his car.

0:36:45.9 Jack Broudy: Lord of cops are tough. Yep. So the sheriff comes back rolls down the window again hands in the ID his ID licenses. You're a damn good tennis player. You have a great day and walks off and drives off. That's classic. So that was that was a funny Samper story. But yeah, so he so we said we used to have we used to go to dinner. I went to dinner with him maybe 15 times and we were you know, he was pretty introverted. So he didn't really have many close friends, but he was a nice guy. He always bought dinner. We I agree. I met him. I've met him a few times. I actually played him once in dubs to and played Luke and dubs. He was scary or actually Luke scary intimidating guy. Those two guys 6-1 like tell Murphy. I mean they've you know, they're they we got some heated Murphy the Jensen Brothers were the precursors to the Brian Brothers, you know, they were right. That's right. They were they were they were much more intimidating and they would get the crowd psyched up, you know doubles back in the 90s was wild Wild West.

0:37:46.7 Jack Broudy: We'd have arguments on the court. We'd yell at each other. There'd be sure. Oh, yeah, everything was like Davis. Everything was like Davis Cup back then. Yes, exactly doubles the doubles tour of the 90s.

0:37:58.3 Mark Keil: Now it's you can use your singles ranking. So back then I thought it was a little I think the doubles was had a little more depth because there was more teams. It was totally different. You had teams now. It's like guys playing singles specialist hooking up with another guy know they're great players. There's no question, but we really dissected the sport in the 90s with doubles when we had teams and where to stand and so forth. I really appreciate you having me on your show and yeah, been great.

0:38:25.1 Jack Broudy: I was going to say I really appreciate I was just about to say that this is really really been great. It's great to you know, reconnect. I'm happy to know that you and I were in touch and friends the whole time you were in San Diego. I didn't know that that's great. Shaka, that's great and I'm glad you're settled in Hawaii and having a good time there and playing ball and staying in shape and all that stuff and well, if you're on the tennis court, you're staying in somewhat better shape the most. How's that I hit with this one guy incidentally Pete Fowler friend of mine.

0:38:55.5 Mark Keil: He he played college basketball DU one of the best players ever play there. So I hit balls with him. But right now I'm just taking a little hiatus from coaching and I just work at the hotel a few days. I jump in the ocean every day. It's a block away. Great. It's nice. I like I like I like it right now. My windows open at 80 degrees, but Jack, it's great to see you man. I keep doing what you're doing. I will tennis Guru. You are a tennis Guru. You need to get out there more often buddy. Hey, thanks man. And by the way, my one of my absolute best friends in life lives in Maui. And so next time I come through you want to hit a few balls. I'd love to come on over. I'll get you a nice rate at this hotel come over for a couple days and we'll hit some balls. Mr. Brody man.

0:39:39.4 Jack Broudy: I'd love that Mark. Thanks so much, buddy. It's been a pleasure. A real pleasure. Aloha Aloha Aloha brother.

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